+     nevries
From: (Nico E de Vries)
Newsgroups: sci.crypt

Subject: Re: IBM-PC random generator, source included
Message-ID: <>
Date: 25 Jun 92 09:45:07 GMT
References: <> <>
+           <> <>
+           <>
Organization: Academic Computer Centre Utrecht
Lines: 31

In <> (Ted Drawneek)  writes:

>Terry Ritter writes:

>> Of course I "believe" in jitter.  I started out as a hardware
>> person.  It is not at all unusual to see a scope display jitter
>> when retiming signals from different clocks in a computing system.
>> That does not make the system nondeterministic.

>The phase noise present even in crystal oscillators is nondeterministic.
>Suppose you have two oscillators in phase at the same frequency, each
>driving some sort of trigger so that nominally they both trigger at the
>same time.  Then would they actually both trigger at the same time?
>Probably not - you would find that sometimes one would be before the other, 
>at other times it would be later,  if you looked closely enough.

Great. Thats excactly what I expected. Does anyone know WHY the "phase noise"
(new term :-)) is nondeterministic? Has this been investigated? Are there
papers which claim this?

>Ted Drawneek

Nico E. de Vries
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